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 Post subject: What's up with the Star Sapphire Corps?
PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 9:23 pm 
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Ok, I've really been enjoying Blackest Night and all (the parts in Green Lantern anyway), and seeing Wonder Woman as a Star Sapphire is really cool, but I really don't understand the Star Sapphire Corps at all. Their emotion is supposed to be love, but each Star Sapphire seems to have their own spin on it. There was that psycho who killed her Green Lantern lover, and there's the one whose husband was killed by Mongul - wouldn't she have become a Red Lantern? Now Wonder Woman has become a Star Sapphire as a result of "her immense love for the planet Earth and all its people".

I guess it seems to me that the Star Sapphires seem to be less of a Lantern Corps powered by Love and more of a "Girl Power Lantern Corps". I realize that the Zamorans are all female, but still... why aren't there any male Star Sapphires? I mean, the old-school Guardians were all male and that didn't stop them from recruiting women.

Anyway, I've been pondering this for a long time now. What are your thoughts on this?

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 Post subject: Re: What's up with the Star Sapphire Corps?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 10:56 am 
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Elven Planeswalker wrote:
I guess it seems to me that the Star Sapphires seem to be less of a Lantern Corps powered by Love and more of a "Girl Power Lantern Corps". I realize that the Zamorans are all female, but still... why aren't there any male Star Sapphires? I mean, the old-school Guardians were all male and that didn't stop them from recruiting women.

Anyway, I've been pondering this for a long time now. What are your thoughts on this?


Well, IMHO the Violet Lantern Coprs/Star Sapphires are probably the most complex of the indvidual Corps. More on this later. :wink:

Firstly, you are correct in that, currently, only women (or females) have been inducted into the Violet Lantern Corps. This isn't because the VLC is a "girls only club" per se, but according to Geoff Johns "anyone can join, but most men are not worthy." (This was in response to the same question when posed to Geoff at San Diego Comic Con 2009)

Elven Planeswalker wrote:
...but I really don't understand the Star Sapphire Corps at all.


See what I mean? Us guys just don't get it I guess... :lol:



Secondly, the further down the emotional spectrum from the middle (Willpower), the more influence the power has over its wielder. Since the emotional spectrum looks like this:

Red (Rage)
Orange (Avarice/Greed)
Yellow (Fear)
Green (Will)
Blue (Hope)
Indigo (Compassion)
Violet (Love)


we can see that Violet is at the one of the far ends of the "emotional spectrum". This is the largest reason the actions of most Violet Lanterns/Star Sapphires act so extremely; they are driven by the power of their rings.

In fact, thus far the only two able to resist the complete influence of their rings seem to be Wonder Woman and Carol Ferris and even they are affected somewhat.

Elven Planeswalker wrote:
Ok, I've really been enjoying Blackest Night and all (the parts in Green Lantern anyway), and seeing Wonder Woman as a Star Sapphire is really cool, but I really don't understand the Star Sapphire Corps at all. Their emotion is supposed to be love, but each Star Sapphire seems to have their own spin on it. There was that psycho who killed her Green Lantern lover, and there's the one whose husband was killed by Mongul - wouldn't she have become a Red Lantern? Now Wonder Woman has become a Star Sapphire as a result of "her immense love for the planet Earth and all its people".


There are a LOT of explanations for the actions you describe above, but at its simplest Love makes folk do some pretty crazy things.

I know this seems pretty glib, but it's the truth. A wise man once told me that "Love is being willing to go to jail for the other person". Pretty intense huh? but there is a nugget of insight and truth there as well.

I think you are definitely correct in that each Star Sapphire has their own spin on Love, but the same is true of members of the other Corps and their powers as well (just think on the numerous members of the Sinestro or Green Lantern corps and how they wield their powers for example).

Most of the other Corps are a bit more straight-forward than the VLC, but let's face it: if Love were easy to understand and qualify, then greeting card companies would be out of business. :wink: The same man who shared the aforementioned bit of wisdom also once told me that "if Love were easy, then anyone could do it". Seems pretty apt in this instance.

ANYhow, I hope this helps. I know Mike will probably have some insight on this matter as well as he is expert on many things Green Lantern. I'll ask him to poke his head in here as well. :D

_________________
"In fearful day, in raging night,
With strong hearts full, our souls ignite,
When all seems lost in the War of Light,
Look to the stars-- For hope burns bright!"


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 Post subject: Re: What's up with the Star Sapphire Corps?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 2:25 pm 
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Munchoboy wrote:
There are a LOT of explanations for the actions you describe above, but at its simplest Love makes folk do some pretty crazy things.

I know this seems pretty glib, but it's the truth. A wise man once told me that "Love is being willing to go to jail for the other person". Pretty intense huh? but there is a nugget of insight and truth there as well.

I think you are definitely correct in that each Star Sapphire has their own spin on Love, but the same is true of members of the other Corps and their powers as well (just think on the numerous members of the Sinestro or Green Lantern corps and how they wield their powers for example).

Most of the other Corps are a bit more straight-forward than the VLC, but let's face it: if Love were easy to understand and qualify, then greeting card companies would be out of business. :wink: The same man who shared the aforementioned bit of wisdom also once told me that "if Love were easy, then anyone could do it". Seems pretty apt in this instance.


In see what you're saying, but I guess that looking at and other Lantern Corps (including the Red Lanterns), I can see the consistency of the motives, emotions, and styles of each user. It just seems to me that the characters of each of the Star Sapphires would fall under other Lantern categories. I mean, Wonder Woman sounds more like Compassion, and the member whose husband was killed by Mongul would be more Rage than anything else. I guess that the psycho I mentioned would be... well, definitely not Love. Wonder Woman shows us that Love does not mean exclusively Romantic Love, so why didn't Superman become the Star Sapphire instead? There is no question how much he loves Earth... (I imagine him more as a Blue Lantern though). Why not Ares for his love of War or Larfleeze or Lex Luthor for their love of material things? Or a parent's love for his or her child?

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-Munchoboy


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 Post subject: Re: What's up with the Star Sapphire Corps?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 5:03 pm 
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Elven Planeswalker wrote:
In see what you're saying, but I guess that looking at and other Lantern Corps (including the Red Lanterns), I can see the consistency of the motives, emotions, and styles of each user. It just seems to me that the characters of each of the Star Sapphires would fall under other Lantern categories. I mean, Wonder Woman sounds more like Compassion, and the member whose husband was killed by Mongul would be more Rage than anything else. I guess that the psycho I mentioned would be... well, definitely not Love. Wonder Woman shows us that Love does not mean exclusively Romantic Love, so why didn't Superman become the Star Sapphire instead? There is no question how much he loves Earth... (I imagine him more as a Blue Lantern though). Why not Ares for his love of War or Larfleeze or Lex Luthor for their love of material things? Or a parent's love for his or her child?


In turn, I can see what you're saying. There are a few considerations worth pondering however:

Firstly, the Rings always search for the most qualified candidate in each space sector. While Carol Ferris is already the Star Sapphire for Sector 2814, when her ring was called upon to create a duplicate and search out another (second most qualified?) candidate, it selected Wonder Woman.

No one's saying that Supes wouldn't be a good candidate (though I see him as a member of the Blue Lantern corps myself), Wonder Woman' selection is based upon the fact that (as Carol Ferris put it) "no one loves this planet and all on it more than her" (I'm paraphrasing but you get the idea).

Let us not forget that one of Wonder Woman's patrons is Aphrodite, Goddess of Love. If that doesn't help one's resume' when being considered as a candidate for the Star Sapphires, I don't know what will.

Secondly, as for the other members of the corps, I do not see why their selection and induction into the corps is all that confusing?

Miri Riam lost her (newlywed) husband when their craft collided with Mongul. While she was desperately sad at her loss, she never "hulked out" or anything. She missed her man is all. When approached by the violet Ring, she accepted it and Love into her heart and became a Star Sapphire.

Dela Pharon's (of Sector 1416) reaction was al ittle more extreme, but again the end result was her acceptance of the violet ring and Love into her heart. True, she nuked her mate in order to keep him close by, and then further isolated themselves off from the rest of the universe, but like I said, sometimes love makes you do peculiar things.

Again, Love is a complex issue and should not be confused with the other emotions in the spectrum. While Love can have a causal effect resulting in expressing other emotions (i.e. Love is the cause, rage the effect, etc...), Love sill remains the wellspring.

is there overlap between the emotions? Certainly, just look at Hal and his "magical mystery tour" across the emotional spectrum. He's worn what, 4 different rings now? :roll:

What the Star Sapphires look for are folk who define their own existence through their love, that is a very different thing than simply feeling love (even feeling great love). IMHO, the candidates selected (with the exception of their "crystal converts") all fit that bill.


As for the other Corps, with the exception of the Green Lantern and Sinestro Corps (and less so the latter), I do not see a great deal of consistency or motivation among their members.

The only characters with any depth and background in the Red Lantern Corps are Atrocitus, Laira, and Guy Gardner, and the only reason the last two have any depth or background is because they've been around for decades as characters prior to joining the Red Lantern Corps! Heck Laira was killed a few issues after accepting the Ring and Guy is about to get sorted out as well, so really the only character that's actually a character is Atrocitus who has been ret-conned into Hal's origin. So at the ends of it, what do we really know about the motives, styles, or emotions of the Red Lanterns in general? An Answer: not much.

The only character with any background in the Orange Lantern Corps is Larfleeze. He's pretty one-dimensional and seems to be around mostly to screw things up and be comic relief. Essentially, he's the Jar Jar of Blackest Night. (I know I'll catch flak for that one but I calls it as I sees it). Don't get me wrong, I like his character and understand him, but he's a(n intentional) caricature of "collectors" everywhere. So at the ends of it, what do we really know about the motives, styles, or emotions of the Orange Lantern? An Answer: not much.

The only characters with any depth and background in the Blue Lantern Corps are Ganthet, Sayd, and Saint Walker. Again Ganthet has been around for decades and the vast majority of his characterization comes from his time as a Guardian of Oa. Sayd was essetially created as a character to fuel the Blackest Night Storyline and will eventually jump ship to become the Guardian of the Orange Lantern Corps so very little's been done to expand her character overall for the time being. Saint Walker seems to be an eternal optimist which actually isn't that difficult to write nor is it really all that deep when it comes to characterization (and this is coming from an optimist). End result: what do we really know about the motives, styles, or emotions of the Blue Lantern Corps? An Answer: not much.

The only characters we've been introduced to in the Indigo Lantern Corps are Indigo 1 and Indigo 2. We really have no idea as to their motivations, styles, or emotions. So again, end result is what do we really know about the motives, styles, or emotions of the Indigo Lantern Corps? An Answer: Nok. I mean, not much.


Now I'm not saying that the Star Sapphires are more fleshed out as characters than the other new corps, but they are certainly no worse off. IMHO, the Star Sapphires even have a leg up on all of the other new coprs (with the possible exception of the Sinestro Corps) since the Zamarons and Star Sapphires have been around forever in the Green Lantern books.

All I'm saying is don't judge the Star Sapphires too harshly, especially when the other Corps really aren't much better off.

_________________
"In fearful day, in raging night,
With strong hearts full, our souls ignite,
When all seems lost in the War of Light,
Look to the stars-- For hope burns bright!"


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 Post subject: Re: What's up with the Star Sapphire Corps?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2010 3:55 pm 
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Hmmm... I guess you're right about all that... but....

Munchoboy wrote:
What the Star Sapphires look for are folk who define their own existence through their love, that is a very different thing than simply feeling love (even feeling great love). IMHO, the candidates selected (with the exception of their "crystal converts") all fit that bill.


OK now THAT makes sense. So each member decides what they think is "Love" and follows through with it. Dela Pharon was just a Psycho like the guy who killed someone (I forget who) because he thought that the First Lady would love him.

Munchoboy wrote:
The only character with any background in the Orange Lantern Corps is Larfleeze. He's pretty one-dimensional and seems to be around mostly to screw things up and be comic relief. Essentially, he's the Jar Jar of Blackest Night. (I know I'll catch flak for that one but I calls it as I sees it). Don't get me wrong, I like his character and understand him, but he's a(n intentional) caricature of "collectors" everywhere. So at the ends of it, what do we really know about the motives, styles, or emotions of the Orange Lantern? An Answer: not much.


But isn't Lex Luthor an Orange Lantern now?

Munchoboy wrote:
Firstly, you are correct in that, currently, only women (or females) have been inducted into the Violet Lantern Corps. This isn't because the VLC is a "girls only club" per se, but according to Geoff Johns "anyone can join, but most men are not worthy." (This was in response to the same question when posed to Geoff at San Diego Comic Con 2009)


Here's the other part I don't get. Why not? (Well, come to think of it, aren't most PEOPLE not worthy of becoming a member of any of the Corps? I mean, Green Arrow can barely form one arrow with a Green Lantern ring.) But anyway, I just don't get this part. I mean, guys can feel love just as much as girls, right?

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 Post subject: Re: What's up with the Star Sapphire Corps?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2010 4:09 pm 
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Elven Planeswalker wrote:
Hmmm... I guess you're right about all that... but....

...

But isn't Lex Luthor an Orange Lantern now?


Lex has been deputized into the Orange Lantern Corps. This means he'll pnly have the ring for 24 hours. Re-read Ganthet's blurb at the end of Blackest Night #6, you'll see what I'm talking about.

Elven Planeswalker wrote:
Munchoboy wrote:
Firstly, you are correct in that, currently, only women (or females) have been inducted into the Violet Lantern Corps. This isn't because the VLC is a "girls only club" per se, but according to Geoff Johns "anyone can join, but most men are not worthy." (This was in response to the same question when posed to Geoff at San Diego Comic Con 2009)


Here's the other part I don't get. Why not? (Well, come to think of it, aren't most PEOPLE not worthy of becoming a member of any of the Corps? I mean, Green Arrow can barely form one arrow with a Green Lantern ring.) But anyway, I just don't get this part. I mean, guys can feel love just as much as girls, right?


Well, as for "Why not?", you're going to have to ask Geoff Johns. Since he is the one making the rules, he's the one with the answers in regards to worthiness and what-not.

Again, it's not a matter of simply feeling love, but rather defining one's existence by it. Go back and re-read my last post if you need to, but there is an universe of difference between the two. I don't know any male characters that define their existence by their love in the DCU. :wink:

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"In fearful day, in raging night,
With strong hearts full, our souls ignite,
When all seems lost in the War of Light,
Look to the stars-- For hope burns bright!"


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